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Thread: Talkback: Court Overturns Peak 4x4 Ban

  1. #1
    Ultra King Imperial Dave's Avatar
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    pathetic

  2. #2
    Ultra King Mikel el Bastardo's Avatar
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    What is?

  3. #3
    Ultra King Imperial Dave's Avatar
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    that a group of environmental despoilers actually had the temerity to request the courts to allow them free rein to desecrate the countryside

  4. #4
    Ultra King Parky Again's Avatar
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    Access for all...

  5. #5
    Ultra King Imperial Dave's Avatar
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    true. might as well put up a few windfarms whilst they are at it

  6. #6
    ‹bermensch
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    Justice has seen sense. Access for everyone - especially where it has long been established.

    Excellent news.

  7. #7
    Widdler
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    All depends on your point of view

    Erosion is in all places as recent floods have revealed, natural erosion will happen in most cases, erosion by animals, Erosion happens on snowdon and thats only excessive walking

    This case highlights 4x4 + bikes on a public road used for generations by all sorts of vehicles, as with most roads with little maintance erosion will take its toll, if the users stick to the proper route and not deviate to other tracks made by someone else who decided to go find the driest/easiest route to avoid a obstacle/rut
    after all i thought the hobby was to have it slightly differcult

    'Food for thought' once people have achieved long term banning of 4x4's or/and bikes , whats next, walkers horse riders? local farmers?

    Fox hunting is banned!

    Isn't it ?
    mmmm

    Are you sure ??



  8. #8
    Ultra King Parky Again's Avatar
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    Access for all...

    Even when that access deprives access for more whose access is for all.

    Love the logic.

    What will they ban next...swordfish, dolphins, brown trout? Crustacea will definitely go.


    I want it all. And I want it now.

  9. #9
    Widdler
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    Oh YES access for all but education has to play a key part plus obtaining useful co- operation between ALL user groups without the necessary bickering from selfish people who believe they have sole right of use.

    There are a growing amount of people who wish to engage with local authorities and Natioanl park authorities to help find a way through problems but banning one user to simplify things is not always the answer

    There is no simply answer but what i do know - talking and reasoning does go a long way to helping the situation

    Positive solutions can be found and have in other areas with great effect but a good understanding of all users needs has to be included to build a platform for a solution




  10. #10
    ‹bermensch
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    Any excess damage caused by these vehicles has to be addressed and I am split over the court victory. first the increase speed of errosion caused by vehicles is fueling the flames for those wanting bans not just for vehicles but most if not all users.

    Secondly who is next ? once they have been banned will it be Mountain bikers then dog walkers then hikers, some who own the land don't think public have a right to be there as it is their land not the publics, some are very happy to see people using the land especially responsibly.

    Something has to be done about the increased speed of erosion as others have said it happens no matter what be it animals floods etc etc but the speed of it with vehicle use is the issue, so my logic says get this group who have vehicles ideal for carrying loads onto the hills to help bring up materials for maintaining the routes, and to use the routes you have to be a member of a club or buy an acces permit each year to fund repair work.

  11. #11
    ‹bermensch
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    If you are a "hill walker"why do you need to follow/use tracks .The National Parks mainly are open access (for walkers)anyway. Cheers.

  12. #12
    Ultra King Parky Again's Avatar
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    Ah politicians in our midst.many words, wooly airy ideas and the sword of righteousness on their side.

  13. #13
    Widdler
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    How can the use of a road which has been legally vehicular for as long as anyone can remember be 'desecrating the countryside'? It was lack of maintenance that caused the problems, coupled with water erosion. Now it's repaired, the 'mud pluggers' will stay away as it's too boring for them.

  14. #14
    Ultra King Parky Again's Avatar
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    Typical sh1te.
    Until the supporters connect their brains to their so called communication skills the more they get banned the better.
    In not one post on here or anywhe else has any supporter even come close to acknowledging the issue or suggested what to do about it.
    It's the usual shouting and changing the subject whilst blaming everyone else fornthe issuenthey are responsible for.
    When the spoilt squalling children start to take responsibility for their actions in an adult manner they aren't going to get any sympathy.

  15. #15
    Mini Goon alex backpacker's Avatar
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    I'm a hiker but I also believe the peaks should be open to the 4X4 guys. Sorry but I agree with the court. I remember when a lot of the paths got closed to mountain bikers which took me off the hills so I know what its like to be banned.

  16. #16
    Initiate Weevil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Parky Again View Post
    Typical sh1te.
    Until the supporters connect their brains to their so called communication skills the more they get banned the better.
    In not one post on here or anywhe else has any supporter even come close to acknowledging the issue or suggested what to do about it.
    It's the usual shouting and changing the subject whilst blaming everyone else fornthe issuenthey are responsible for.
    When the spoilt squalling children start to take responsibility for their actions in an adult manner they aren't going to get any sympathy.
    It's hard to know whether to agree with you or not Parky.

    What are you trying to say?

  17. #17
    ‹bermensch
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    Quote Originally Posted by no longer the 'office manager' View Post

    Evening all, just got back from a weekend with my nephew in Amsterdam. My flight home was cancelled due to SNOW at Amsterdam. There must have been at least 1/2 an inch for all of 10 minutes!!

    Don't let anyone tell you it's just us Brits that fall apart at the slightest suggestion of bad weather, the Dutch do it too! And the guy at KLM even admitted that their trains suffer from 'leaves on the line'!!! Whatever next!!

    Anyway I'm back and I've even got a voucher for a ‚?¨50 discount off my next flight. I'm pleased with that, as well as the ‚?¨10 food voucher.
    Quote Originally Posted by Parky Again View Post
    Typical sh1te.
    Until the supporters connect their brains to their so called communication skills the more they get banned the better.
    In not one post on here or anywhe else has any supporter even come close to acknowledging the issue or suggested what to do about it.
    It's the usual shouting and changing the subject whilst blaming everyone else fornthe issuenthey are responsible for.
    When the spoilt squalling children start to take responsibility for their actions in an adult manner they aren't going to get any sympathy.
    I suggested they pay for a permit and also that they must be part of a club to use these tracks.

    Also that they help in the repair and upkeep of these routes for the benefit of all.

    If you have better solutions Parky lets hear them because the more ideas the better for all users of these routes.

    I am against the damage caused by any user but equally damage occurs naturally plus these routes to be honest are not natural anyway they are man made so man can maintain them but do so sympathetically to the sourounding enviroment.

    If a law came out here in England that to use the countryside especially places like the Lake district for example would cost me £20 a year or say £40 for a family and in return i could wild camp responsibly without breaking any laws or if you did not want to pay you could log onto a gov site and register to be part of a work groupdoing much needed maintenance for the same pass then so be it after all better that than bans being enforced on a group then possibly others as well.

  18. #18
    ‹bermensch
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    Ok sorry edit button gone again please ignore office managers quote above

  19. #19
    ‹bermensch Montgomery Wick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by alex backpacker View Post
    I remember when a lot of the paths got closed to mountain bikers which took me off the hills so I know what its like to be banned.
    Really? I've been MTBing since 1990 and I don't remember any significant closures of tracks that MTBs were previously allowed to ride. The reverse is true - trail centres, waymarked routes, tracks upgraded to permissive bridleways, etc. The spectre of trail closures for mountain bikers is largely propaganda put out by the offroad motoring fraternity.

    I used to give a shit about this, but now I just go where the fat fuckers can't drive, so it doesn't affect me.

  20. #20
    ‹bermensch
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    MW

    there were a lot of rumours about banning MTBers from the hills because they did not respect other users rights came hurtling down the paths making walkers have to dodge out of the way and in some walkers eyes endangering their lives. I remember the MTB mags running stuff about how bikers should respect other users slow down even dismount if needs be and that if these things did not happen there was the real possibility of MTB's being banned.

    I do not remember paths being closed for any other reason than maintenance though but the threat of a ban was real and hovering over the MTB community for a good few years.



    As I have said before my worry is that if the walking/hiking community support a ban who is next? We should be encouraging open debate and the search for solutions that allow all groups to access the countryside.

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